Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 34

Thread: Validating ID of parents for OH forms

  1. #1
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    123
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Validating ID of parents for OH forms

    Following on from the success of our first outdoor Beaver camp earlier this year, we decided to hold a Big Adventure summer camp for Beavers and parents. Take up has been fantastic and here lies the problem. Our GSL is insistent that the evidence for identity checks for all OH CRB applications can only be validated by him. Not a problem you may think but it has proven to be so.

    Our GSL doesn’t see us every week and understandably some of our parents have refused to hand over their driving licence / passport into my care until he has seen them.

    So my question arises purely out of bone idleness into researching POR. Is he right or can I as a section leader validate their identity?

  2. #2
    GSL & AESL shiftypete's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Leeds
    Posts
    12,448
    Thanks
    3,622
    Thanked 1,214 Times in 805 Posts
    I don't know if they are right but our DC says any adult member can complete the ID evidence part. I have certainly done it for other Leaders.

    Peter Andrews ESL of Headingley Pirates ESU, Group Scout Leader & Webmaster of Falkoner Scout Group
    www.falkonerscouts.org.uk

    Previous Scouting Roles
    2003 - 2013 ABSL
    2017-2018 AGSL

    Wike, North Leeds District Campsite - www.wikecampsite.org.uk
    www.leeds-solar.co.uk
    Please note all views expressed are my own and not those of any organisation I'm associated with

  3. #3
    Russ Dyble
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Hemel Hempstead
    Posts
    125
    Thanks
    26
    Thanked 10 Times in 5 Posts
    Anyone can countersign (the form asks for their membership no.)
    In an ideal world, GSL would have put time aside to respond to this knowing that you'd planned this, but I would suggest a work-around.
    He will still need to countersign the line manager section of the AA form, but can do this without seeing the individual.
    I am assuming that he knows / has met these people - as he is effectively recommending them for a role?
    Russ

  4. #4
    a quiver full of barbs merryweather's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    'auchtermuchty'
    Posts
    7,661
    Thanks
    398
    Thanked 1,751 Times in 1,055 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by gingst View Post
    Following on from the success of our first outdoor Beaver camp earlier this year, we decided to hold a Big Adventure summer camp for Beavers and parents. Take up has been fantastic and here lies the problem. Our GSL is insistent that the evidence for identity checks for all OH CRB applications can only be validated by him. Not a problem you may think but it has proven to be so.

    Our GSL doesn’t see us every week and understandably some of our parents have refused to hand over their driving licence / passport into my care until he has seen them.

    So my question arises purely out of bone idleness into researching POR. Is he right or can I as a section leader validate their identity?
    the gsl is perfectly entitled to insist that all OH applications go through him.

    do they need to be done by him? no. can they be done by a section leader? yes.

    i do think that your gsl is being somewhat unreasonable by insisting he does the id checks and yet doesn't seem to want to make himself readily available.

    talk to him and see if you can reach a more workable arrangement.

    if he insists on the procedure he has prescribed then that's what you should do.

    hand out the OH forms. arrange a date for their return. ask the gsl to attend on that date to check id and sign them off.

    if the gsl won't attend on a convenient date then tell them what effect that will have on your future participation on camps/activities where adult/parent/OH support is vital.

    my gsl doesn't mind who checks ids, him or section leaders are okay. all that he insists on is that he's told of OH applications. but then my gsl is a great guy!

    cordially yours, TM

  5. #5
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    123
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
    The GSL is of course aware and very supportive of the camp, unfortunately he can't join us every week due to work commitments. He did suggest that all the parents who wished to have their forms validated should attend a meeting when he will be there, easier said than done though I'm afraid and quite frankly it hasn't happened.

    As for recommending them for the role, well, there again most are not intending to take a role but are completing the form so that they may attend camp. He certainly hasn't met all of them.

    Please believe, I'm not trying to usurp his powers, merely trying to find a workable solution.

  6. #6
    Senior Member Bushfella's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Huddersfield
    Posts
    15,714
    Thanks
    432
    Thanked 2,970 Times in 1,616 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by gingst View Post
    The GSL is of course aware and very supportive of the camp, unfortunately he can't join us every week due to work commitments. He did suggest that all the parents who wished to have their forms validated should attend a meeting when he will be there, easier said than done though I'm afraid and quite frankly it hasn't happened.

    As for recommending them for the role, well, there again most are not intending to take a role but are completing the form so that they may attend camp. He certainly hasn't met all of them.

    Please believe, I'm not trying to usurp his powers, merely trying to find a workable solution.
    Gingst,

    If I as a GSL insist on a method of operation, then it is incumbent upon me to make it work. Take what you will from that.

    All CRBs come through me, but they are often checked by others first. Is that possibly your solution?
    Ewan Scott

    It seems that there are a lot of Nawyecka Comanch around....





    Nawyecka Comanch'": "Means roundabout--man says he's going one way, means to go t'other" Ethan Edwards - The Searchers



    www.upperdearnevalleynavigators.org.uk

  7. #7
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    123
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
    Thank you for your time gentlemen. You've satisfied me that there probably isn't such a rule and I'll now reseach POR to that effect.

    I'm sure that my GSL has merely misunderstood the system.

  8. #8
    Senior Member DonTregartha's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Wing, Buckinghamshire
    Posts
    5,639
    Thanks
    733
    Thanked 493 Times in 298 Posts
    A scout is to be trusted.

    Your GSL should allow the leaders to check the IDs

    Make life easier.


    Don Tregartha
    Old Scouter
    1st Wing Scouts

  9. #9
    Map Geek marcush's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    4,495
    Thanks
    106
    Thanked 32 Times in 30 Posts
    Your GSL is doing what they feel best, and they can do that, but in an ideal world it would make sense that all section leaders, BSL/CSL/SL could at least do IDs.

    May be worth speaking to GSL to fins out what nights they can do and then tell parents what nights to bring ID down on.

    Rule 66. A map and compass offers no protection against getting horribly lost.

  10. #10
    Senior Member Ian Mallett's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Birstall, West Yorkshire
    Posts
    1,083
    Thanks
    256
    Thanked 50 Times in 37 Posts
    I allow section leaders to check the id of parents of YP in their section returning OH forms. The forms then come to me to pass onto district. Works for us.
    Simba (my daughter wouldn't let me be Rafiki, and now she's a Network Scout & ABSL)
    ABSL
    Birstall Scout Group
    West Yorkshire

  11. #11
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    1,201
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
    We work a very similar system. Section leaders check ID, forms go to GSL (who usefully checks we haven't filled them in wrong) and then onto district.

    Keeps GSL in the loop, and keeps the system moving speedily.

  12. #12
    Senior Member Matt Donnelly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Merseyside
    Posts
    1,076
    Thanks
    705
    Thanked 263 Times in 139 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by TudorSN View Post
    Anyone can countersign (the form asks for their membership no.)
    In an ideal world, GSL would have put time aside to respond to this knowing that you'd planned this, but I would suggest a work-around.
    He will still need to countersign the line manager section of the AA form, but can do this without seeing the individual.
    I am assuming that he knows / has met these people - as he is effectively recommending them for a role?
    Russ
    Just to point out that the Occasional Helper form does not have a line manager approval section on it.

    I'd agree with the approach others have mentioned.
    Scout Active Support Member & Webmaster
    Deep Sea Scouts National SASU


    Membership Data & Engagement Support Manager
    Merseyside County Scouts


    Webmaster
    St. Helens Scout District - 1st Whiston Scout Group - 1st Kirkby Scout Group


    Tawd Vale Active Support Unit
    Tawd Vale Scout Camp

  13. #13
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    123
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
    Having admittedly only skimmed POR for clarity on this issue, does a parent actually need an OH application for a one off camp ?

  14. #14
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    1,201
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
    If they are there overnight then yes.

  15. #15
    Senior Member Matt Donnelly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Merseyside
    Posts
    1,076
    Thanks
    705
    Thanked 263 Times in 139 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Scary Monster View Post
    If they are there overnight then yes.
    Or if they are likely to have any unsupervised contact with the YP - which on camp is frankly difficult to avoid.
    Scout Active Support Member & Webmaster
    Deep Sea Scouts National SASU


    Membership Data & Engagement Support Manager
    Merseyside County Scouts


    Webmaster
    St. Helens Scout District - 1st Whiston Scout Group - 1st Kirkby Scout Group


    Tawd Vale Active Support Unit
    Tawd Vale Scout Camp

Similar Threads

  1. Parents helping out one evening only, forms?
    By Richard T in forum Scouting Talk
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 06-03-2011, 08:59 PM
  2. [Answered] CRB / OH Forms & Parents Rota
    By RachelF in forum UK Chief Commissioner Questions (CLOSED)
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 21-04-2010, 04:52 PM
  3. CRB / OH Forms & Parents Rota
    By Ian Mallett in forum Related Discussion UK Chief Commissioner Questions
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 27-03-2010, 05:29 PM
  4. CRB / OH Forms & Parents Rota
    By Ian Mallett in forum Related discussion -Chief Scout Questions
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 26-03-2010, 12:26 PM
  5. Validating HTML? Help Needed!
    By bandmaster in forum Scout Websites & Computers
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 02-01-2004, 06:18 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •