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Thread: Scout brand review

  1. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by mang21 View Post
    Skills for life seems to me to be a good "selling point" - yes we structure it around adventure (learn to make a cup of tea - but we might use a fire as well as an electric kettle!) but ultimately what I value from my time in Scouting is the life skills I came away with, like problem solving and stuff like being able to cook.
    I thought so. I've always clearly understood that the adventurous activities were a smokescreen*, and the real aim was to offer opportunities for development (of skills). Teamwork and leadership being prominent among these. Hence the centrality of the Patrol System. Skills for life may not be quite the way BP would have put it, but it's not far off, and the press reports sound pretty close to, as someone said up-thread, going back to basics. So that sounds fine to me.

    * Of course the activities are important, not least in attracting members. But there are any number of activity providers out there; activities are two a penny these days. There's nothing quite like Scouts, however, in the way that we deliver them. (And our use of volunteers means that we offer life skills plus our activities are cheaper than most.) So, to attract parents, activities may not be the be-all and end-all.
    SL, 11th Hitchin

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  3. #137
    Senior Member johnmcmahon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kev View Post
    The PL calls the Troop to Alert.

    He strides over to the flag, pulls the cord and it falls, still rolled up, to the floor.

    He steps back, salutes, strides back to his Patrol and calls the the Troop to "at ease". As he does so, Skip falls over as he was standing on his shoe lace.

    The troop then go outside and watch the kayaks floating down the river.

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  5. #138
    AESL & AGSL shiftypete's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kev View Post
    I must admit that I seem to have managed 15+ years as a Leader only knowing about 5 knots or hitches (reef knot, sheet bend, figure of eight, clove hitch and timber hitch).

    Peter Andrews AESL of Headingley Pirates ESU, Assistant Group Scout Leader & Webmaster of Falkoner Scout Group
    www.falkonerscouts.org.uk

    Wike, North Leeds District Campsite - www.wikecampsite.org.uk
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    Please note all views expressed are my own and not those of any organisation I'm associated with

  6. #139
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnmcmahon View Post
    The PL calls the Troop to Alert.

    He strides over to the flag, pulls the cord and it falls, still rolled up, to the floor.

    He steps back, salutes, strides back to his Patrol and calls the the Troop to "at ease". As he does so, Skip falls over as he was standing on his shoe lace.

    The troop then go outside and watch the kayaks floating down the river.
    I'm sorry.

    Have I been doing it wrong?


  7. #140
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    He steps back, salutes, strides back to his Patrol and calls the the Troop to "at ease". As he does so, Skip falls over as he was standing on his shoe lace.
    Have I been doing it wrong?
    Yes, everyone knows that Flag Break/Flag down is the correct time to tie your shoelaces or face an urgent need/requirement to go to the toilet

  8. #141
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    Quote Originally Posted by DKRSL View Post
    I thought so. I've always clearly understood that the adventurous activities were a smokescreen*, and the real aim was to offer opportunities for development (of skills). Teamwork and leadership being prominent among these. Hence the centrality of the Patrol System. Skills for life may not be quite the way BP would have put it, but it's not far off, and the press reports sound pretty close to, as someone said up-thread, going back to basics. So that sounds fine to me.

    * Of course the activities are important, not least in attracting members. But there are any number of activity providers out there; activities are two a penny these days. There's nothing quite like Scouts, however, in the way that we deliver them. (And our use of volunteers means that we offer life skills plus our activities are cheaper than most.) So, to attract parents, activities may not be the be-all and end-all.
    I wouldn't say they were a smokescreen. I'd say the aim (on a generic level) is teaching skills for life, and the method is activities (both adventurous and not).

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by shiftypete View Post
    I must admit that I seem to have managed 15+ years as a Leader only knowing about 5 knots or hitches (reef knot, sheet bend, figure of eight, clove hitch and timber hitch).
    I can only really do climbing knots - fig 8 follow through, bowline (but ONLY one handed, I can't do the other way easily), double fisherman's, clove hitch plus the reef (and granny) knots. The others I can do if I've got instructions but not off the top of my head. I can also do something that approximates to a round turn and two half hitches but probably isn't quite, and my own brand of guyline slider knot, I suppose.

  9. #142
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neil Williams View Post
    I wouldn't say they were a smokescreen. I'd say the aim (on a generic level) is teaching skills for life, and the method is activities (both adventurous and not).
    Yes, fair comment. They are pretty fundamental. I possibly overstated my case. Your way of putting it is better. Aim and method is exactly the way we always talked about it, and activities were never the aim, only the method. By "we", I include POR, if I recall correctly.

    I'm not sure it should ever have changed!
    Last edited by DKRSL; 11-03-2018 at 11:43 PM.
    SL, 11th Hitchin

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  11. #143
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    Quote Originally Posted by wealdbrook View Post
    What is the hardest Challenge Badge for me to get the Scouts to achieve - the Skills Challenge where they don't want to/can't do/can't be bothered to try the household skills. As I look around the Challenges I see lots of "skills for life" and less and less "Scouting skills" like firelighting, pioneering, knotting, camping, being self reliant, etc.
    I have a few who have finally managed to do this but I sent home a sheet for all scouts and one of them came up to me and said 'these are mum's jobs'. He hasn't had it signed off yet!

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    ESL and DESC ianw's Avatar
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    Aaand as is the modern way, a "journalist" copies it from one paper and publishes it in another a day or two later. It's in the Daily Wail now. I started up an incognito browser session and looked. It's got reader comments. Oh yes. They are as predictable as you can imagine. Best I saw was "the new logo will probably have a crescent moon and star in". Endless "PC gawn mad" comments. Most entertaining.
    Ian Wilkins
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  13. #145
    Senior Member CambridgeSkip's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ianw View Post
    Aaand as is the modern way, a "journalist" copies it from one paper and publishes it in another a day or two later. It's in the Daily Wail now. I started up an incognito browser session and looked. It's got reader comments. Oh yes. They are as predictable as you can imagine. Best I saw was "the new logo will probably have a crescent moon and star in". Endless "PC gawn mad" comments. Most entertaining.
    I saw that they'd picked it up but decided not to click. The readers comments don't surprise me. Was there a "BP turning in his grave"? Please tell me there was! There normally is!

  14. #146
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    The Daily Mail comments are fun. One I did like was that, when you re-brand to 'remain relevant', you alienate the people who were attracted to your OLD brand. I hadn't thought of that before. I think that the lesson of the Church of England could be relevant here.

    One comment amused me. It was about the need for a '1907' Scout group, to maintain the original values of B-P. Makes you think that maybe the B-PSA need to work on their branding :big smiley:

    Edited to add: Going on that site nearly broke my ad-blocker! Don't think I'll try that again.
    Last edited by Ihatecamping; 13-03-2018 at 10:30 AM.
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  15. #147
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    Sounds hard to sell what scouting is in 134x86 pixels. I don't know. The BSA sure fails at that. The best they have is a sterile, formal looking emblem and the catch phrase is Prepared. For Life. Sounds a bit too ... I don't know, presumptuous. Who has the answers for life.?And if it's less than that then maybe it's a preparatory class for ... prison? We'll teach your kid how to make a shank? It's just wrong. It's also not on the BSA website. It just shows what the webmaster thought of it.

    I finally found the UK Scouts logo. Believe it or not it's on the UK scouts website - on the home page. What an idea! I like the artwork. There's no need to change that. It's a nice balance of light and serious. They were even thrifty, they took the swoosh from Nike. Then there's the catch phrase. Be Prepared ... sounds great, if you already know what that means. If you know nothing about scouts it's missing something. And what about the '...'? This is a catch phrase, not a sentence. Catch phrases are definite. Don't be vague. Someone suggested Skills for Life? Probably better but, umm, sounds like a Monty Python lead in. Always look on the bright side of life! That might work.

    They should be bold. Just cut to the chase. What do parents really want? The parents that don't know anything about scouts. That's who the target audience is. What do they want? Motivating your slacker kids! Well, okay, a bit much. How about Motivating Teenagers! But it also has to appeal to said teenagers. Fun - Without Your Parents. That might be too far the other way. I like Bill Hillcourt's phrase: Fun With a Purpose. It's a little mysterious, that purpose. Is it what the parents want or what the kids want? Is it responsibility or knowing enough to not get arrested? Is it leadership and teamwork? Or how to plan a road trip?

    You could probably have it done in an hour and have plenty of time left for a few beers. If you don't mind, please send the result to Michael Surbaugh, c/o BSA, Austin Texas, USA.

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  17. #148
    AESL & AGSL shiftypete's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MattR View Post
    I finally found the UK Scouts logo. Believe it or not it's on the UK scouts website - on the home page.
    The UK Scout Association Logo, which is what is definitely changing, IS on the website, its top left of all the pages http://scouts.org.uk/home/

    Peter Andrews AESL of Headingley Pirates ESU, Assistant Group Scout Leader & Webmaster of Falkoner Scout Group
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  18. #149
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    Yes, that's what Matt said - in a sarcastic reference to the absence of the logo on the BSA website.
    John Russell
    ex-CSL now ACSL 1st Pinhoe Exeter Devon
    Cubs don't care how much you know, but they need to know how much you care.

  19. #150
    AESL & AGSL shiftypete's Avatar
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    Ahh sorry misread that as its not on the Uk Scouts website, I read it two or three times as well which is a little worrying lol

    In which case a small BSA logo looks to be top left of the home page of the BSA website as well, no Prepared for Life strap line though if that was what MattR meant
    Last edited by shiftypete; 13-03-2018 at 05:47 PM.

    Peter Andrews AESL of Headingley Pirates ESU, Assistant Group Scout Leader & Webmaster of Falkoner Scout Group
    www.falkonerscouts.org.uk

    Wike, North Leeds District Campsite - www.wikecampsite.org.uk
    www.leeds-solar.co.uk
    Please note all views expressed are my own and not those of any organisation I'm associated with

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