Page 3 of 3 FirstFirst 123
Results 31 to 40 of 40

Thread: The end of YouShape

  1. #31
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    4,335
    Thanks
    1,554
    Thanked 1,190 Times in 864 Posts
    Aye true enough.

    The places we've visited, have also had a bit of an interest in having us in - usually down to PR. We always say they'll get goo coverage on or Facebook page (which gets a lot of views from parents and friends of parents).

    The places we've visited locally have been on account of having an inside person. Further afield, it's been a pure blag effort.

    I think as well though, it's probably an extension of people being risk averse when it comes to dealing with young people.

    Which is a little depressing.

  2. #32
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Herts, UK
    Posts
    716
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 131 Times in 99 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by pa_broon74 View Post
    I am aware there are troops who's meetings are ran by PL's or young leaders, or that are heavily fed into by things like forums and PL councils, but I don't think they're the norm. If they are, I don't think they're anything like as autonomous as we're they're being portrayed.
    Fair challenge. We do try to involve our PLs, as I've attempted to describe, but no, they aren't autonomous, or anywhere near it. I think I've mentioned up-thread that, on camp, we try to create the illusion of independence more than the reality.

    But it's still valuable to exchange experience, because I'm challenged by what I read here that others do.
    SL, 11th Hitchin

  3. The Following User Says Thank You to DKRSL For This Useful Post:

    pa_broon74 (10-09-2019)

  4. #33
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    4,335
    Thanks
    1,554
    Thanked 1,190 Times in 864 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by DKRSL View Post
    Fair challenge. We do try to involve our PLs, as I've attempted to describe, but no, they aren't autonomous, or anywhere near it. I think I've mentioned up-thread that, on camp, we try to create the illusion of independence more than the reality.

    But it's still valuable to exchange experience, because I'm challenged by what I read here that others do.
    I'd love for our PL's and YL's to have a much greater say (and active role) in what we get up to. I think though, it's a generational thing (sort of). You need to start them on the road either in Cubs or as soon as they come up into Scouts. I think this is where we fall down.

  5. #34
    Senior Member Bushfella's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Huddersfield
    Posts
    15,716
    Thanks
    433
    Thanked 2,973 Times in 1,618 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by pa_broon74 View Post
    I'd love for our PL's and YL's to have a much greater say (and active role) in what we get up to. I think though, it's a generational thing (sort of). You need to start them on the road either in Cubs or as soon as they come up into Scouts. I think this is where we fall down.
    Some on here have, in the past, established patrols and essentially told the PLs to "get on with it". I think that is a bit simplistic as they only know what they know. But in essence they allow them to stand or fall by their own actions.

    I'm not in this, nor are any of my team, to see young people fail, so perhaps we are more supportive than we might be. But... that is reflected in the way the schools operate as well...
    Ewan Scott

    It seems that there are a lot of Nawyecka Comanch around....





    Nawyecka Comanch'": "Means roundabout--man says he's going one way, means to go t'other" Ethan Edwards - The Searchers



    www.upperdearnevalleynavigators.org.uk

  6. #35
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Herts, UK
    Posts
    716
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 131 Times in 99 Posts
    Has anyone tried Patrol meetings to any extent? We did them for quite a time, although mostly when PLs were older than they are now. I know that quite a few turned into movie night or whatever, but at least they built up the Patrols socially. I believe that some Troops have run with many/most meetings being Patrol-based (i.e. separate meetings, as opposed to using Patrols in Troop meetings, which we do all the time).
    SL, 11th Hitchin

  7. #36
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    4,335
    Thanks
    1,554
    Thanked 1,190 Times in 864 Posts
    Since the age changes, the patrol system (for us) has never been the same. To be fair, it was never great, but we had functioning patrols, we did inspections, had patrol based activities and games - and to a certain extent it worked.

    Over the past few years though, our troop has become ever more homogenised. There is no hierarchy. Out of the four PL's we have, if we're lucky only one will have any interest in leading a patrol.

    We no longer give the PL job to the next scout only in terms of age. We did away with a lot of the we-do-it-this-way-because-we-always-do-it-this-way stuff. It now goes to who we think will actually lead. Really though, the PL thing was so much dead-horse flogging. I was thinking of doing away with patrols and PL's completely, but it would have other ramifications I didn't fancy.

    Also, on the basis that some of the kids still covet the job, it seemed unfair on them to do away with it.

  8. #37
    Senior Member Bushfella's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Huddersfield
    Posts
    15,716
    Thanks
    433
    Thanked 2,973 Times in 1,618 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by pa_broon74 View Post
    Since the age changes, the patrol system (for us) has never been the same. To be fair, it was never great, but we had functioning patrols, we did inspections, had patrol based activities and games - and to a certain extent it worked.

    Over the past few years though, our troop has become ever more homogenised. There is no hierarchy. Out of the four PL's we have, if we're lucky only one will have any interest in leading a patrol.

    We no longer give the PL job to the next scout only in terms of age. We did away with a lot of the we-do-it-this-way-because-we-always-do-it-this-way stuff. It now goes to who we think will actually lead. Really though, the PL thing was so much dead-horse flogging. I was thinking of doing away with patrols and PL's completely, but it would have other ramifications I didn't fancy.

    Also, on the basis that some of the kids still covet the job, it seemed unfair on them to do away with it.
    Sounds very similar to what we did in Scouts. All mates together, patrols in name only.

    In Navs, I don't run Patrols at all ( shock horror), kids fall into their own "patrols" as it were and we get along just fine. That is to say, once we removed the disruptive and negative elements, we have got along just fine.

    Easier for us to do this from a fresh start than going the whole hog in Scouts.

    It is maybe worth noting that day One after our resignation, the DC and his team stepped in and started telling the Scouts that they had to operate in patrols. They couldn't do as they had done in the past. Day one he had them doing inter parol competitions. That was one of the biggest drivers for kids leaving the Troop.
    Ewan Scott

    It seems that there are a lot of Nawyecka Comanch around....





    Nawyecka Comanch'": "Means roundabout--man says he's going one way, means to go t'other" Ethan Edwards - The Searchers



    www.upperdearnevalleynavigators.org.uk

  9. #38
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Herts, UK
    Posts
    716
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 131 Times in 99 Posts
    I'm slightly afraid of going over old ground, but our PLs inspect other Patrols on a rotation basis (two Patrols to the left this week, that sort of thing). Many activities, and those games which lend themselves to it, are Patrol-based. Night hikes etc. are also normally Patrol-based. Camps normally work as Patrols (albeit typically not the weekday ones, because we don't get high enough attendance for that to work). And, as I've mentioned, the PLs meet with the leaders to set a programme each term. I agree that some Scouts don't exactly put their hearts and souls into the PL role, but I do try to emphasise the importance of it in setting the spirit of the Troop, and most covet the role when their turn is coming. No, the oldest Scout is not always chosen.
    SL, 11th Hitchin

  10. The Following User Says Thank You to DKRSL For This Useful Post:

    shiftypete (10-09-2019)

  11. #39
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    4,335
    Thanks
    1,554
    Thanked 1,190 Times in 864 Posts
    The problem we have the patrol system is as already mentioned, but also down to spotty attendance by PL's. (Although since we moved the last lot on, that's actually improved...)

    We also don't really put much stock in things like uniform, so inspection would be a bit moot.

    As already mentioned, that whole doing it in a way we've always done it, because we always did it that way etc etc. It used to be the at the kids would come up from Cubs and the leader would put them in what ever patrol had space, where their pals where was not considered. I now ask them where they want to go, and they go.

    What that means is, we spend less time getting them to stay in their patrols during activities and more time just doing the activity. It does mean there are some disparities - we have a group of older scouts who aren't really a patrol, or in a patrol, (I got fed up with them not doing flag break properly - making up daft names each week. They finally settled on the pigeon patrol). But we do have three moderately high functioning patrols for flag break and flag down.

    We don't do patrol activities, we don't organise them in that way. We just ask scout to get in to groups of what ever numbers we need and they sort themselves out.

    I think though, it's one of Scout's qualities, that there is this broad church of techniques. It also shows that there's no one specific way things should run, and leader teams have the latitude to do things in a way that suits the conditions. I was thinking about this today, the whole cookie-cut leader/franchise scout troop thing HQ have got going on. It's why I no longer wear a uniform. It's my slightly petulant way of not conforming.

    Obvs totally subjective, and a digression too. But there it is.

  12. #40
    Senior Member Bushfella's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Huddersfield
    Posts
    15,716
    Thanks
    433
    Thanked 2,973 Times in 1,618 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by pa_broon74 View Post
    I got fed up with them not doing flag break properly - making up daft names each week. They finally settled on the pigeon patrol).
    I had a really, really dizzy "patrol", they selected a badge from the book... I said, "Okay, Rhino Patrol." They said, No, Dickhead Patrol"...

    It was rather apt... But, one is now a geologist and deep sea diver, the another is an officer in the Royal Navy, a two, I lost track of, and the last one sadly decided that he had enough of life.

    Two still keep in touch from time to time. It is odd how things somehow turn out.
    Ewan Scott

    It seems that there are a lot of Nawyecka Comanch around....





    Nawyecka Comanch'": "Means roundabout--man says he's going one way, means to go t'other" Ethan Edwards - The Searchers



    www.upperdearnevalleynavigators.org.uk

  13. The Following User Says Thank You to Bushfella For This Useful Post:

    pa_broon74 (12-09-2019)

Similar Threads

  1. YouShape Activity Inspirations Pack
    By Kastor in forum Scouting Talk
    Replies: 36
    Last Post: 20-03-2017, 05:08 PM
  2. #YouShape Ideas and Tips
    By scoutadelic in forum Scouting Talk
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 09-02-2017, 11:37 PM
  3. First #YouShape Challenge
    By oneiros in forum Scouting Talk
    Replies: 47
    Last Post: 17-02-2016, 02:00 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •