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Thread: 2019 Census

  1. #46
    ESL and DESC ianw's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neil Williams View Post
    It would make sense for it to be open for a week or two beyond 31st Jan for people to get figures in, with a deadline of half way through Feb.
    It is open for weeks, I mean, I haven't tested the boundaries, as I'm a good boy I am, but it's open for editing until the DC hits the "submit" button, and then it's open for reading more or less until just before the next census.
    Ian Wilkins
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    Quote Originally Posted by dsheehan View Post

    I appreciate the figures might be skewed across the country by a tiny percentage but its would be a pretty clear indication none the less. Theres nothing to stop the data being old even if it cant be entered early!
    The figures will not be skewed any more than those Groups who under report every year. We all know that they are there and it happens.

  4. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by daveb123 View Post
    The figures will not be skewed any more than those Groups who under report every year. We all know that they are there and it happens.
    If only there was a plan to develop a national database of all the youth members. Such a database would help to ensure accurate information was submitted at census time (with the system generating the census info) and also enable names to be checked if deemed necessary.

    - "I can see Johnny and Jane have just completed their transition from the Pack to the Troop, but can't seem to find them on the database."
    - "Why haven't Gertrune and Albert's parents received the email about discount for shopping at x?"



    Paul

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  6. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by PaulArthurs View Post
    If only there was a plan to develop a national database of all the youth members. Such a database would help to ensure accurate information was submitted at census time (with the system generating the census info) and also enable names to be checked if deemed necessary.

    - "I can see Johnny and Jane have just completed their transition from the Pack to the Troop, but can't seem to find them on the database."
    - "Why haven't Gertrune and Albert's parents received the email about discount for shopping at x?"



    Paul
    As you know we have nearly been there. :-)

    That said as has been stated here previously we have an adult database that is capable of holding all the Census info for adults so the Census should be able to be done from that.

    We all know (yeah right) that all adults keep their personal details up to date along with gender (that doesn't change for most people), ethnicity and any disabilities etc.

    It was stated that some adults have more than one role - well Compass shows the primary role that can be changed by the user and their managers. Even Networkers if they hold an adult role can be calculated as both Network and Adult role (I appreciate that other Network Members are not all on Compass).

    There seems to be no reason therefore that adults need to be accounted for on the census as all ther roles along with primary are on Compass (or should be).

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    Scout Leader bellshillscouts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dsheehan View Post
    Very different story in our District. We get so much grief is we don't meet growth targets that the fear is always of submitting under last year rather than over!
    Your District sets targets???? Seriously!
    I thought it was supposed to be a hobby and fun.

    Neil

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  10. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by bellshillscouts View Post
    Your District sets targets???? Seriously!
    I thought it was supposed to be a hobby and fun.
    Targets they may have, but I just submit what the numbers are. If my best efforts are not enough, my resignation would always be on offer if they wished. Plenty of other roles out there.

    Fortunately my District is not unreasonable in this way.

  11. #52
    Senior Member Bushfella's Avatar
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    I never got why so many people had so many issues with the census.

    A group knows who its members are, age, gender etc. It is a simple head count. The only time it becomes a problem is when people try to defraud the system by not including these "between" sections etc..
    Ewan Scott

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bushfella View Post
    I never got why so many people had so many issues with the census.

    A group knows who its members are, age, gender etc. It is a simple head count. The only time it becomes a problem is when people try to defraud the system by not including these "between" sections etc..
    It should be Ewan. We know in practice that there are Groups who have appalling records. I have known Groups submit census info when names etc had to be passed on where a child's surname was not know or an address or date of birth not known as the child had just moved sections.

    So there is little hope of some of them knowing whether there are any disabilities, the ethnicity or the number of top awards gained.

    I agree though that to an organised Group this info should be readily to hand and census can be done in an hour or so.

  13. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by bellshillscouts View Post
    Your District sets targets???? Seriously!
    I thought it was supposed to be a hobby and fun.

    Neil
    How else do you claim your annual bonus payment if you don't evidence that you've exceeded your product sales target?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Bushfella View Post
    I never got why so many people had so many issues with the census.

    A group knows who its members are, age, gender etc. It is a simple head count. The only time it becomes a problem is when people try to defraud the system by not including these "between" sections etc..
    It's not a 'simple head count' - it's an increasingly complicated presentation of the data with subdivisions and double counting issues to reconcile. But otherwise I agree with you.

  14. #55
    Senior Member big chris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dsheehan View Post
    Very different story in our District. We get so much grief is we don't meet growth targets that the fear is always of submitting under last year rather than over!
    A wise leader once said (i forget who but i liked it) that although one of a GSL's main jobs is the growth of the group... that does not mean simply more kids and more adults.

    It can be growth of skills (more permits holders, for example), it can be growth of camping style (greenfield and not just weekends at an activity centre), it be an improved HQ to allow the programme to grow and develeop.

    Any group that does not grow is being failed by its GSL but there is much more to growth than the number of kids on 31 January. (And in a big group, where birthdays fall can see fluctuations of 20 or so easily)

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  16. #56
    ESL and DESC ianw's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bellshillscouts View Post
    Your District sets targets???? Seriously!
    Mine doesn't set targets, but the DC does like getting lego minifigures through the post.

    Quote Originally Posted by bellshillscouts View Post
    I thought it was supposed to be a hobby and fun.
    See previous answer, lego is a hobby and fun!
    Ian Wilkins
    Farnham District Explorer Scout Commissioner

    Jambowlree - Worldwide Scout Ten Pin Bowling Competition
    All sections, all countries, runs December 2018 - May 2019
    http://www.jambowlree.org

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  18. #57
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    I love the annual thread about the census...

    Well, I don't love it... In some ways, it's like time standing still, or groundhog day.

    I have nothing constructive to add. Except to say, if anyone moaned about our growth not being satisfactory, I'd ask them to visit one of our meetings where I'd arrange for the kids to point and laugh (hard) as they came into our hall.

    Some folk are doing it wrong. And I don't mean the census.


  19. #58
    Scout Leader bellshillscouts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ianw View Post
    Mine doesn't set targets, but the DC does like getting lego minifigures through the post.
    Funnily enough, I've got a lego minifigure!

    Neil

    lego skipper.jpglego skipper2.jpg

  20. #59
    Senior Member Bushfella's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by daveb123 View Post
    It should be Ewan. We know in practice that there are Groups who have appalling records. I have known Groups submit census info when names etc had to be passed on where a child's surname was not know or an address or date of birth not known as the child had just moved sections.

    So there is little hope of some of them knowing whether there are any disabilities, the ethnicity or the number of top awards gained.

    I agree though that to an organised Group this info should be readily to hand and census can be done in an hour or so.

    Okay, appalling records... how stupid must those Leaders be, to take in kids and not have their contact details?

    What kind of Leader is not aware of the various disabilities in his section?
    Ewan Scott

    It seems that there are a lot of Nawyecka Comanch around....





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    Quote Originally Posted by Bushfella View Post
    What kind of Leader is not aware of the various disabilities in his section?
    I have two Scouts on the spectrum. Well I think I do. With one the mum has maintained that there is nothing wrong. After three years she put something a text about his needs, but had never defined them. We had worked that out by ourselves by then. The second Scout has parents that are lovely, but they had assumed I have had over from the cub section. I did not. I have been told some ways of supporting, not what he has.

    I would not describe either Scout as highly functioning. I can work with them and will ensure they have decent access to things.

    So I would not be able to complete that section.



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