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Thread: Troop Flag as Group Flag ?

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    Troop Flag as Group Flag ?

    We have quite an experienced Leader who is telling us that the Troop flag also serves as the Group flag. So, if the Scout troop is not participating in a parade the Troop flag can accompany, for instance, the Cub Pack to represent the Group.

    Other Leaders are disputing this.


    Does anyone have any knowledge as to this?

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    Never heard of that one - we tended to have a Union Flag and then the flags of whichever sections were attending. (And that dates back into the 1980's`!) Wasn't aware there was even a concept of a Group flag.
    Does anyone know what's going on?

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    Haven't heard of that one either. We have a troop flag, it gets wheeled out for investitures and for armistice. The cubs have their own flag - which is a replacement because the original went walkies.

    If the Cub pack didn't have their own and didn't want to get one, then they could use the troop flag to show what group they're from. It's not a huge impropriety... But I don't think you can call it a 'group' flag... I don't even think the Union Flag can be called that, it's just a random (if now very old) union flag. Well, ours is.

    (Our old SL went and bought a marching union flag... But, we can never get enough kids down for two flag parties. I'm not sure why we bothered to be honest.)

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    The unpaid help ASLChris's Avatar
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    Never heard of such a thing. The flag of the sections which are attending should be flown. Indeed, there's no such thing as "the Group flag" in POR (Chapter 12) - just sectional ones.
    Chris Hawes, District Media Manager, Watford North Scout District and Watford Scouts; Group Treasurer and Webmaster, 9th North Watford Scout Group.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ASLChris View Post
    Never heard of such a thing. The flag of the sections which are attending should be flown. Indeed, there's no such thing as "the Group flag" in POR (Chapter 12) - just sectional ones.
    and neither do Scout Shops Limited / Scout Store sell a 'Group Flag' - https://shop.scouts.org.uk/essentials/flags/flags

    POR 12.1a refers to Group Flags, but I assume this means flags for the sections within a Group rather than a flag for the Group.

    Never heard the suggestion that the Troop Flag is also the Group Flag.

    Paul

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    Senior Member big chris's Avatar
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    My last group, we flew the troop flag in the hall along with the union flag for all section... i have seen that a few times, i think

    i realise that this wasn't the question but now i think about it, the section flags did not have colony/pack/troop on them

    they just said the group name. at camps, the troop flag would be flown, no matter the section because we had a green flag that could be flown while the others were on poles.

    i wonder if something similar has developed at your group.
    Last edited by big chris; 18-02-2019 at 05:17 PM.

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    We have an 'unofficial' Group flag which is a moth eaten Troop flag from the 1950s -60s. Its not paraded (I doubt it would survive a prolonged gust) but its brought out for Group photos...say at the start/end of our yearly sponsored walk - having been transported safely in someones rucksack (minus flag pole)

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    I'd suspect that he may be referring to very old understanding that the Scout troop being the senior section.
    I was told by a former DC that because the group did not have a GSL then the Scout leader as head of the senior section was ipso facto acting GSL.

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    Quote Originally Posted by an hour a week! View Post
    I'd suspect that he may be referring to very old understanding that the Scout troop being the senior section.
    I was told by a former DC that because the group did not have a GSL then the Scout leader as head of the senior section was ipso facto acting GSL.

    When I started at my current group the Scout Leader was of that opinion. The DC at the time didn't fancy the battle of convincing him otherwise...

    I would dearly *love* to live in a world where the scout troop had another name, A Scout Group that consisted of Beaver Lodges, Cub Packs, and (say) Ranger Troops would make it a lot easier to talk about without getting confused.

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    Quote Originally Posted by an hour a week! View Post
    I'd suspect that he may be referring to very old understanding that the Scout troop being the senior section.
    I was told by a former DC that because the group did not have a GSL then the Scout leader as head of the senior section was ipso facto acting GSL.
    Like a few DCs you read about here, it sounds as if (s)he didn't really understand the role of a DC!
    Peter

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    A journey of a thousand miles must begin with a single step.Ě Lao Tzu (600 BC - 531 BC)

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    Quote Originally Posted by an hour a week! View Post
    I'd suspect that he may be referring to very old understanding that the Scout troop being the senior section.
    I was told by a former DC that because the group did not have a GSL then the Scout leader as head of the senior section was ipso facto acting GSL.
    Eugh.
    Chris Hawes, District Media Manager, Watford North Scout District and Watford Scouts; Group Treasurer and Webmaster, 9th North Watford Scout Group.
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    We donít have a Group Flag, we do have a Group Banner, one of those plastic things that you see advertising companies or events.

    When we went down the route of group t-shirts, we bought it because it matched them, same colour and has the same logo, we use it to identify our area on large camps, attended by multiple groups, it means Beavers, Cubs and some Scouts can easily see where our area is.


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    Shaun

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    Senior Member BalooNav's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigBadBaloo View Post
    Like a few DCs you read about here, it sounds as if (s)he didn't really understand the role of a DC!
    or they _really_ did and was happy to pass the buck

    Sent from my SM-G903F using Tapatalk

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    I would love to live in a world where people have got better things to worry about than criticise people for the 'wrong' flag.

    I'm all for a good tradition and the nature of them some groups have different ones to others.

    Our explorers for a couple of years paraded the old venture flag since a new explorer flag was - and still is - outside their budget. The VSU had the same name as the ESU and the flag still flies in the hut alongside the others, we're hardly going to bin it. Of course the parade organisers and the British legion were just grateful the kids had turned up and were proudly marching. But some other district leader complained and had a moan (bravely via email to someone else, not to us). I'd have told him where we would next be inserting it personally, but our ESL was too nice, let it go and now they walk without a flag which I think is a big shame.

    I guess there is a limit somewhere but if there's a flag the kids want to be associate with, as long as it still genuinely represents them and isn't hurting anyone else or scoutings image then it should be ok...

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    We had our Beavers parade with the old Venture Scout flag a couple of years ago, as the Beaver one had vanished. no one batted an eyelid.

    On the subject of Flags, if you've ever been abroad with Scouting, why is there always a separate Scottish Flag (St Andrews Cross) as well as the union Flag, but oddly no St Georges Flag for England?
    POR states this
    When abroad, Groups may use the Union Flag and the flag of the host nation displayed equally.
    e. Groups may use the flags of the constituent countries of the United Kingdom, together with their own corresponding flag, when in another United Kingdom country.

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